THE
CHINUA ACHEBE FOUNDATION INTERVIEW SERIES
November 2005
All Rights Reserved ©
November 2005
All Rights Reserved ©
*Achuzia |
*About
Col. Joe Achuzia
Born seventy years ago, in the present
day Delta State , Col Joe Achuzia has been involved in
the programmes and activities of Ohaneze
NdiIgbo, the apex socio-cultural organization in Igboland, for the past
fifteen years. Since he assumed office as the Secretary-General of Ohaneze NdiIgbo, he has been
distinguished by his frankness in public communications and the passion with
which he canvases the Igbo position on matters of national and regional
interests. He believes strongly in one, united Nigeria , where equity, justice,
fairness and mutual respect for one another are unreservedly operational at all
levels of governance and social interactions. He is of the opinion that the
deterioration in the country is as old as the country itself and that the only
way to ensure harmony and progress in the nation is to convoke a conference of
ethnic nationalities where the thorny issues plaguing Nigeria could be properly
addressed.
After the Biafra/Nigeria in which he played a
prominent role, he was detained by Nigerian authorities. Fearing he might not
survive the incarceration, he wrote his book, Requiem Biafra, to
articulate his role in the war, and check attempts by later writers to, in his
own words, “superimposed falsehood” on
him.
Excerpts:
WHERE THE RAIN BEGAN TO
BEAT US
Do you think it is possible to identify a particular period in Nigeria’s
history when the deterioration commenced, or should we assume the downward
slide is, perhaps, as old as the nation itself?
Why then does your generation speak nostalgically about the good old days?
The good old days is
a cliché used by people reminiscing about their secure lives
as adolescents, and referring to the past as “the good old days...”The bad old days then begins when they have to
start taking responsibilities. (Laughter)
So, there have been no good old days in Nigeria ?
No, there
has been nothing like that.
A
PEOPLE AND THEIR LEADERS
Blames for Nigeria ’s
endless woes have largely been heaped on its leadership. The consensus is that
this has remained the main source of our problems. What then accounts for our
perennial failure to solve a problem we have clearly identified?
Yes, we
all know that the problem of Nigeria is leadership; but as
I have said, the gladiators in the field who fought the mortal combats to get
us independence did not realize that their period of leadership ended with the
ceasefire. They should have allowed the peacemakers who were not as
battle-hungry as they were to take over. This inability to effect a change of
baton is largely at the root of Nigeria ’s leadership problems.
What blame might be apportioned to the electorate?
You can’t
apportion any blame to the electorate. A lot depends on the mechanism that is
in place for elections. Every election requires umpires that are independent,
not subject to any powers, whether high or low. And for Nigeria to
have such umpires, may take years. Unfortunately, elections succeed within a
culture that we have not yet imbibed in Nigeria .
There are suggestions that the most effective way to make INEC truly
independent and free from manipulations, especially from the government in
power, is for its top officers – its Chairman, in particular – to be appointed
by a body made up of representatives of political parties, and its funding to
come from a consolidated revenue fund.
I don’t
believe in that. My ideal INEC is an INEC that metamorphosed out of a law that
grants it total independence, and also insulates it from persecution of any
type, so that, when we are looking for an INEC chairman, we will go for
somebody that meets certain criteria. In fact, such a person, under normal
circumstances, should be equal to the task if the mantle falls on him to lead
the country. It is such a person that can be an independent INEC chairman. And
I don’t think you can get it by the amorphous contribution of every political
party. Neither can you get it by involving the president in the nomination
process.
HIS IDEAL NIGERIA
What would be your ideal Nigeria ? Indeed, what is it that
seriously tasks your faith in Nigeria – something that
demoralizes you whenever you think about the country?
What
pains me is the issue of ethnicity. However, I am a chieftain of my ethnic
group, because I wanted to insulate my people against the various attacks
arising from the multiplicity of ethnic groups in a country like Nigeria . For
this country to move in the right direction, instead of all these conferences
that have been so far convened, there should be a conference of ethnic
nationalities, where we are able to identify and consolidate those things that
bind us together, and jettison those things that continually divide us. Until
that is done, all talk about One Nigeria is
fairy tale.
Let’s
face it. Every group is suspicious of the other. We must realize that nobody is
a fool. Platitudes cannot put food into on’s stomach. Platitudes cannot give us
good roads. Platitudes cannot put our children in good schools. Platitudes
cannot find our children jobs after their national service, and these are
largely due to ethnic issues that must be solved first before any person
envisions ruling Nigeria .
You cannot say – Oh, ethnicity doesn’t exist, or I don’t want it. And if you
claim that you don’t want it, then what are you doing about it? The only person
I will consider capable of telling me about the issue of One Nigeria is
someone who, tomorrow, is ready to call a meeting of ethnic nationalities in
order to resolve the issue of ethnicity once and for all.
This is
what plunged us into the first coup, pushed us into the civil war, and directed
the activities of the military through the civil war. It continued to direct
the activities of the military after the civil war, and continues to direct the
activities of the political parties in the country today.
*Achuzia |
OHANEZE AT NPRC
Ohaneze Ndigbo, whose Secretary-General you are, sent representatives
to the just concluded National Political Reforms Conference (NPRC). What made
you think any good would come out of that Conference?
Ohaneze didn’t send representatives to the
Conference. For Ohaneze Chairman (Prof Joe Irukwu) to be there
was an imposition by the presidency on Ohaneze. We didn’t take
kindly to it, because he did not impose on the conference, the president
of Arewa Consultative Forum (ACF), the president of Afenifere
or the others. Why must it be the President of Ohaneze that he
had to ask for? For that, we call it an imposition. Prof. Irukwu had no option,
but to attend.
A call to national duty?
That’s
right. So, people shouldn’t be saying that Ohaneze sent people
to the conference. Ohaneze did not send anyone there.
Now assuming there was a formal request for you to send representatives,
would you have obliged?
If there
was a formal request we would have sent people who would represent us
adequately; because the leadership of Ohaneze, we believe,
should remain in the background, directing the affairs of the body.
There were newspaper reports that you were dissatisfied with the
performance of the group that went there. Was that true?
Yes. I
said I was disappointed, because there was no cohesion. Those who attended the
conference, though NdiIgbo and even
members of Ohaneze, were sent by their governors. And instead of
carrying out Ohaneze’s programmes, they carried out their
governors’ programmes. That was my grouse.
ETHNICITY
AND DISCONTENT
What, in your view, is the cause of so much discontent in the country?
Do you think that fairness, justice and equity are allowed free play in the
implementation of public policies and treatment of people in Nigeria ?
Yes, like
you said, fairness, justice and equity, are what everybody wants. But fairness,
justice and equity cannot exist in a multi-ethnic environment; hence I have
said that until Nigeria solves
the issue of ethnicity, it cannot be one country. Either ethnicity takes a back
seat, or all groups must be fused together to give a semblance of one ethnic
whole.
Apart from convening a conference of ethnic nationalities, what other measures
do you think could be undertaken to adequately solve the ethnic tension
plaguing the nation?
You
cannot just remove ethnic tension, because it is only when a person from one
ethnic group sees himself as part of other ethnic groups that he will be able
to regard everything that reaches him as fair.
THE
IGBO QUESTION
Q. There is what is now widely acknowledged as the “Igbo Question”;
what actually is this Question, and how is Ohaneze resolving
it?
A. The Igbo Question or Equation,
which ever you choose, is the dissatisfaction among NdiIgbo. This, again, brings us back to ethnicity, and the fact
that, as a group, we are having a raw deal in Nigeria . The war ended over thirty
years ago, yet we are being denied our rightful place within the organized
society known as Nigeria .
What we are saying, to use an Igbo adage, is: ‘Emee nwata ka emere ibe ya,
obi adi ya nma’ (If you
treat a child the same way you treat other children, that child would be happy,
and would not have any reason to feel cheated). We feel we are being cheated.
We feel we are being marginalized. We feel we are being treated as the dog of
the earth. And we are saying: Enough is enough! We will not have it any longer.
And that is why we are saying that, come 2007, that a Nigerian of Igbo
extraction must be given an opportunity to rule this country, because we feel
we are qualified and competent. We have the men. If you don’t find them in the
South-East, you will find them in the South-South. That’s what we are asking
for. And any attempt to deny us this will not spell very good for 2007.
Look at
what is happening in Nigeria .
The Igbo people are dissatisfied. They don’t have enough. They see the whole
country swimming in wealth that belongs to all of us, yet only leftovers are
thrown out to them. In every other part of Nigeria , bridges are being built
all over the place. Yet to spare a dime to build a second bridge over the Niger so as to
relieve the terrible congestion, has become impossible. Also, to dualize
certain highly strategic roads is difficult. The roads that you find in
Igboland were built long before Independence .
And note that when we say Igboland, we mean as far as Agbor, all the way to the
borders of Ikot-Epkene, and then, down to Ahoada – all these constitute what is
known as Igboland. We are not talking about land mass here. We have no problems
with where anybody comes from. Nigeria can even be divided
into two hundred zones instead of the present six zones, we don’t care. They
can go ahead and make a state out of every family; we have no problems with
that, so long as each person sees the other as his brother.
And treat each other fairly too?
Yes, and
treat each other fairly.
Now, the Biafra/Nigeria War ended more than three decades ago. Without
meaning to open old wounds, may I ask: Why did you go to war?
We didn’t
go to war, because we felt we were being marginalized. No. You must separate
the problem of Nigeria before
the Civil War, and the reasons why the Igbo fought. The Igbo fought when the
pogrom started, and they were being killed and pushed out of the federation.
So, to ensure that they stayed in the federation, they had to fight or else, it
would have meant being dispossessed of their land. So where were we expected to
run to when the hostilities started –to Cameroon ? So these were the
reasons. Again, you must try to differentiate the reasons for the Civil War
from the reasons why Nigeria had
a coup, and some people carried out “Operation Wetie”, and the civil strife the country has experienced
since the 1950s.
So it was merely a battle for self-preservation?
Exactly.
Can you tell us, as an Igbo leader, whether it is true that NdiIgbo are
hated by Nigerians of other ethnic groups? Can you confirm the widespread
impression that the NdiIgbo are constant targets of needless
aggression in other parts of the country? If yes, is there anything about the
Igbo that provokes this aggression?
If there
is any aggression against the Igbos, I will say that they are responsible for
it. Look around, and you will see that of all the three major ethnic groups,
neither the Hausa/Fulani – that is, the Arewas, nor the Yorubas, would go to any part of the
Eastern Region to set up a home. It’s only the Igbo that would go to another
person’s land, and make the place his home; even make himself more comfortable
than the owner of the place. This has a way of generating envy and resentment.
And that is the cause of what appears to be hatred against the Igbos. Well, it
isn’t hatred, just envy. Go to several Yoruba cities, except recently, most of
the houses there were built by Igbos. Go to the North, the best houses you will
see there were built by Igbos. Go to Abuja ,
almost ninety percent of all the buildings there, including hotels and
everything are owned by the Igbos. How do you expect that there will be any
love lost between the indigenes there and their august visitors – the Igbo?
So what happens to the quest for
a united Nigeria ?
If NdiIgbo are making homes in various parts of Nigeria ,
is it not a clear indication of their belief in One Nigeria? Or do the others do not believe them?
Only the
Igbo believe in One Nigeria, and pay the required dues to make it work.
The others merely pay lip service to One Nigeria, for the purpose of
what they call Federal Character. Put a Northerner in a position within the
governance of this country, and he will surround himself with fellow
Northerners. Put a Yoruba man in the same position, and he will do the same.
It’s only the Igbo man whom when put in a position of authority, will not allow
another Igbo man to come close to him. He would rather work with non-Igbo to
prove that he is civilized. In fact, he won’t even speak the Igbo language at
work. But how can you be the only civilized person in a country of uncivilized
people? You will stick out like a sore thumb. And that’s what the Igbo are –
they stick out as a sore thumb within the context of One Nigeria.
Now, given the situation you’ve described, as an Igbo leader, what is
your advice to NdiIgbo?
As a
leader, I would prefer a situation where even the lion and the lamb can lie
down together without any aggression from one to the other. But you see, that
is far from reality. A Northerner will tolerate an Igbo man as long as he (the
Northerner) remains on top. A Yoruba man will tolerate an Igbo man as long as
he (the Yoruba man) is on top. But if the situation is reversed, he can only
tolerate an Igbo man on the condition that the Igbo man doesn’t bring another
Igbo person near himself. The same too applies to the Northerner in relation to
the Igbo man. So, the Igbo man must learn to behave like the fowl in our
proverb. When she finds herself in a new
environment, she will resort to standing on one leg. After she had mastered her
environment, she will then bring down the other leg, and stand firmly. So,
each time an Igbo man gets to the North, for instance, he should first look
back and ask himself how Northerners who live in Igboland conduct themselves?
Do they build mansions? Do they set up business empires? If you realize that
they don’t, then, when you get to his place, you do as they do when they are in
your own area. Else, he will feel antagonized by your presence, because, it
would appear you are trying to show him that you are cleverer, smarter, or more
civilized than he is. I would also advocate the same thing, when an Igbo man
goes to live in the West.
But what do you see as the ultimate solution to this problem; this
suspicion that is everywhere? What can be done to ensure the total absorption
of NdiIgbo, so they could live anywhere in Nigeria without any fear of
molestation?
When you
talk of the Igbo being fully absorbed, you make it appear as if the Igbos are a
pariah nation, a pariah group. Why should they seek to be fully absorbed in an
arrangement they were party to in the first place? The nation, Nigeria ,
was packaged by three groups, the Igbo, the Yoruba, and the Northerners, that
is, the Hausa. When the colonial masters were here, this was their interpretation
of the arrangement. Why should the Igbo now come and beg to be accepted? If
they don’t want the Igbo, let them say so and the Igbo will go away. But if
they expect that going away means leaving the land for anybody, that can’t
happen! Going away means that the Igbo will begin to draw boundaries or veils
between the belligerent groups that don’t want them.
ABANDONED
PROPERTY
What does the phrase, “Abandoned Property,” mean to you?
Abandoned
property is a language coined by people intent on perpetrating daylight
robbery. You cannot abandon what you own, in your own home, in your own land.
You cannot live in Nigeria ,
and tell another Nigerian that he abandoned his
property in his own home? How does property become abandoned in this situation;
where is it abandoned – China , Korea , Kenya or South Africa ?
Before the so-called abandoned property issue, the entire
Eastern Region was one; the Western Region was also one. It was the same thing
with the North. These three regions came together to form the country now known
as Federal Republic of Nigeria, and by that act of federation, they all became
one. The implication then is that somebody from the Northern Region, for
instance, can go to the Western Region and own some property or to the Eastern
Region, and vice versa. Why then should it be that all of a sudden, properties
acquired in the same country are declared “abandoned,” yet everyone is still claiming to be in a
federation? Some people are being told that they “abandoned” their properties and other people, including the
government put in place to protect the people and their property, are illegally
exploiting the benefits from those properties. That just can’t be fair.
How can Ohaneze ensure that this matter is amicably
resolved?
It is not
for Ohaneze to see to how the matter should be addressed. The
balkanization of the arrangement called the Nigerian Federation, has now
transferred the responsibility to get this matter resolved to the various state
governments. It isn’t Ohaneze’s responsibility, because although Ohaneze represents
all NdiIgbo, it cannot speak for the Igbo in different states on such issues
like the “abandoned properties.” The reason is that by virtue of the creation of
states, there are some NdiIgbo located even in some of the states where the “abandoned
property” issue exists. So what do you do in that case? The issue is the
responsibility of those in authority, in government, like the governors of the
various states that feel short-changed by the fact that their citizens are
being denied ownership of properties they acquired in other states.
INTER-ETHNIC
DIALOGUE
Does Ohaneze attempt to engage its counterparts in
other zones or ethnic blocs in meaningful dialogue?
Yes,
leaders and executives of the different ethnic nationalities meet from time to
time to exchange notes to see how unity can be fostered. Like I said earlier,
the only way to solve Nigeria’s problem is to let the ethnic groups dialogue
among themselves; they should come together to exchange views and see how to
remove those areas that cause discord amongst them, and package together those
things that give them all common relief. Maybe from there we will start
thinking in terms of One Nigeria, because ethnicity
is fallout from tribal sentiments.
MASSOB
As an Igbo leader and chieftain of Ohaneze, you are probably in the best
position to tell us what MASSOB means?
Well,
MASSOB is the acronym for Movement for the
Actualization of the Sovereign State of Biafra . For
me as an Ohaneze chieftain, it doesn’t convey the type of
meaning that should give me joy, for the following reasons: as elders, we
believe that since we quit the battle field, all our efforts should now be
geared towards winning peace, freedom and total integration for our people.
That the youths, because of the severe hardship unleashed in the polity, now
feel that they would rather pursue a separatist alternative shouldn’t give us
joy, because we know the consequences of such a division. Hence Ohaneze is
still fighting to make sure that there is no more marginalization.
MARGINALISATION
Why do Ndigbo say they are marginalized?
The Igbo
feel marginalized, because, in the first place, they are foremost in education.
In industrial and technological pursuit, they are on the frontline. In which
ever field of endeavor you want to look at, they excel; yet the Igbos have not
been given the opportunity to prove their mettle in any of these fields.
Mediocrity is being entrenched in the country; in the place of ability or
competence, we have what is called federal character. In other
words, once you have, for instance, taken one or two Igbo persons out of ten
that are qualified, you must then go and get ten less-qualified people from
other places to make up the number, in the name of giving equal opportunity to
all. To us, this amounts to marginalization of the Igbo.
Again, as
you go towards the East, take a look at the roads. Which leads me to ask – why
must it take the Federal Government thirty years to start thinking of
rehabilitating roads and bridges that were built or damaged over sixty years
ago? Now, erosion is turning arable land in the East into gullies, gutters, and
perhaps, tomorrow, a desert. And you are asking me what is meant by
marginalization? And yet, from the same East, yes, Igboland sits on top of oil.
If you dig on any part of Igboland, you will find oil; however, the Federal
Government will say that because of the cost of exploration there, it should
remain as reserve. And yet when they are distributing money based on what
accrues to the nation from oil, the Igbo people are excluded. How can you be
sitting on top of oil, and you are being told you are not an oil producing
area? That is marginalization. The money that accrues from all these resources
goes towards developing an arid desert, turning it into an El Dorado .
Desertification came as a result of excessive dryness, the absence of water,
but today, trees grow in the desert, because there is now water in the desert.
Even the
lordly Niger can
no longer flow, because money from the South-East, South-South, is pumped into
the creation of huge dams in the North. In fact, they are almost creating huge
lakes -- I don’t call them dams any more – all over the arid land.
So, we
are no longer prepared to have surrogates any more. No more imposition of
leadership on the Igbo. The Igbo must search within Igboland for their own
leaders. And if by chance or through error of omission such surrogates are
imposed on us, and we find out, our children whose future is being mortgaged by
such means, will rise up and remove such persons. And whoever agrees to be used
for such a purpose cannot be accommodated in Igbo land.
OHANEZE
AND 2007
Could you please tell us the programes of Ohaneze Ndigbo,
especially, under the present leadership?
Part of
our programme for the past year is called Igwebuike, that is: Unity
is Strength. The new executive has spent one year in the activity of mobilizing
the Igbo people. And we are doing everything, trying to put in place new
executives in the various chapters of Ohaneze in the Diaspora,
and at the same time, calling on every Igbo person to realize that they are
part of Ohaneze. Just because not all NdiIgbo attend meetings does
not mean we are not aware of the existence of each and everyone. Nobody is a
castle unto himself; no Igbo man will say that he is sufficient unto himself.
We are trying to teach everybody that we are our brothers’ keepers and that we
have a common destiny, one objective. And the only way we can achieve these is
by coming together, pulling our resources together, and putting our minds
together. When that is achieved, each time the Igbo man breathes, Nigeria should
shake, because we know our strength and our mettle. Anybody that says that we
are not entitled to it should then come out and challenge us openly.
Assuming there is justice, fairness and equitable distribution of
resources, would it still be necessary for people to insist that someone from
their area must assume the leadership of this country?
No, but
that isn’t yet the case. Things are not yet equitably distributed. How long
then should the Igbo man wait? We have paid our dues; we have served Nigeria creditably.
We have helped to package other people from other areas into the seat of
governance. We have even agreed to serve as their deputies. So, now, what is
wrong in our saying that we do not want to be deputies any more; that we want
to produce the person to occupy the main seat, because we are sure that we have
something to offer the country? Since peace and stability have continued to
elude the country, we think that maybe we have the right answers. My friend, we
must be given the opportunity to salvage this country, if not, the country will
perish, and so will everyone in it. We cannot allow the future of NdiIgbo to be
destroyed because of ethnic rivalry; we will go all out to salvage our future,
even if it means that in doing so, it becomes something else. We must try or
die in the attempt – for the children of NdiIgbo.
ANAMBRA
POLITICAL CRISES
There is a growing impression
that throughout last year, Anambra was the troublesome baby of Nigeria . Now,
there is no person better placed to tell us what is actually happening in
Anambra than the Secretary General of Ohaneze NdiIgbo.
No, you
are wrong. Anambra is not the troublesome baby of Nigeria . The
situation there is being brought on by an imposition. What you are seeing in
Anambra is not targeted at Anambra as currently constituted, but a programme
designed for the humiliation of NdiIgbo. If you took
notice, before the advent of Dr. Chinwoke Mbadinuju as Anambra Governor, all
the military governors or the military administrators that were sent to Anambra
were those that were supposed to loot the area, and pay tributes to certain
masters outside Igboland. From the period of Mbadinuju, efforts were being made
to change the situation but it was’t possible. When Mbadinuju was the governor
there, I remember that I came there to see him, and to speak on his behalf and
that of Anambra in respect of the pressures being mounted on him to ensure that
he did not serve the people properly. The first election was targeted at
removing him, creating a fiasco and setting up Anambra as a cauldron of
inconclusive leadership. Anambra is part and parcel of Igbo land. What is going
on there, I repeat, is not targeted at Anambra per-se, but at the whole
of Igboland.
Using Igbo sons?
Of
course! Yes.
And is there no way Ohaneze can contain the activities
of those Igbo sons that are being used to destabilize the place?
Until we
are able to remobilize the Igbo people to return to their position prior to the
Civil War and during the Civil War, we cannot wrest the oppressive arm of
government being imposed on Anambra.
There is a belief that, because the present Governor, Dr. Chris Ngige,
has been able to cut off those conduits through which Anambra’s resources were
being sucked away, hell has been let loose on him.
No, I
would not say so. Governor Ngige knows what pact he made, and consequently he
is the only one that can extricate himself from the situation. We in Ohaneze have
been watching and trying in our various ways to assist. Not to assist to impose
Ngige on Anambra or NdiIgbo, no, but to assist to extricate Ngige
from the quagmire of deceit and oppressive party leadership in which he found
himself.
IGBO
YOUTHS AND EDUCATION
There is current media hype on the low enrolment of Igbo youths in
schools; now, if this is true, what is Ohaneze doing to
address the situation?
The low
enrolment I believe is caused by two factors. One is excessive poverty in
Igboland, and the cost of education. The youths have now discovered that due to
the penalty imposed on Ndigbo by the powers that be in Nigeria ,
Igbo children, after their mandatory one year NYSC programme, find it
difficult, because of their Igbo names, to get employment. So they are forced
to reason like this, may be: Why litter the place with educated young men, who
cannot find job placements despite the promises that education is the way
toward fulfillment and better living?
But will NdiIgbo not eventually lose out in the scheme of things in the
nation if Igbo youths continue to drop out of school?
But that’s
the intention of the present Nigerian leadership. Ohaneze and Ndigbo are,
however, still doing everything they can to make sure that that’s not the case.
ON
CORRUPTION
Some people are saying that President Obasanjo has stepped up the fight
against corruption, while some others maintain that the crusade is only a tool
to persecute perceived enemies? Now, how do you see it?
The
country is corrupt. Corruption didn’t start yesterday. To stop corruption, you
must start from somewhere. I give the president credit for having the will to
fight corruption, not minding the cost. There have been other presidents and
heads of state in Nigeria –
if you go through the records, you will discover that their records are tainted,
not only as harbingers of corruption but leaders of corruption and corrupt
practices. At least, we are happy that one head of state has woken up one
morning, and decided that enough is enough, no matter the cost to himself.
But a number of people maintain, based on recent reports, that the
anti-graft battle appears to be waged with soiled hands?
There is
nothing like fighting corruption with soiled hands. If you are a good
Christian, you must remember that it is said: repent of your sins and you will
be forgiven and made whole. We can’t say that because I made a mistake in the
past, and have now realized the proper thing to do, I shouldn’t go ahead and
rectify the situation?
But assuming that the person appears not to have changed? Did you read
the details of Gov Orji Uzor-Kalu’s allegations against the president? You are
also aware of what transpired during the launching of the Presidential Library?
I can’t
believe that Orji Uzor Kalu made those accusations, which I read in the
newspapers. I also read the president’s response. He said that he who is
already on the ground need fear no fall. The president feels that he is on a
sure ground, that corruption must be fought. He even gave orders to the same
authority that is invested with the powers to fight corruption to investigate
the accusations against him, and make their findings public. For me, it takes
courage, and somebody with clean hands to say such a thing.
But the EFCC appears to be developing cold feet now?
That’s
your assumption.
No, from newspaper reports today.
Yes,
that’s still your own conclusion and assumption. Did the EFCC tell you that
they have developed cold feet?
They are saying that they are waiting for Orji Uzor Kalu to supply them
with evidence.
Correct!
If you make allegations, you must be prepared to prove them.
HIS
VISION AND PERSON
What would you say is your vision for Nigeria ?
What I
expect to see is a Nigeria where all the various ethnic groups live in peace,
side by side under a true federation; a federation of equal partners; a
federation where spiritual pursuits are allowed to be the personal affairs of
individuals, not that of the state; a federation where every Nigerian is free
to ply his trade wherever he wants without let or hindrance; a federation where
our children will grow with a vision of self respect wherever they find
themselves in this world; a federation where the name Nigeria does not confer
pariah status to those that identify with it; a federation where every child
that is born in Nigeria can walk with his head high, knowing that tomorrow will
be better than today; a federation free of corruption, free of political
chicanery and all sorts of vice; a federation untainted by any schism as a
result of religion.
Our intention, in this interview, is to seek realistic solutions. Now, you
have such wonderful expectations, but how do we go about realizing them?
Well, I
should think that the first step is for everybody who wishes or expects to lead
this country to first search his conscience and ask himself whether he has got
what it takes to lead the country. He should be asking himself: can I make the
necessary sacrifices without trying to enrich myself at the expense of fellow
Nigerians? Have I the mental capacity to lead the people out of the present
quagmire in which they have found themselves. If his answers are in the
affirmative, then the person can bring himself before the people and we will
give him the leadership on a golden platter.
Majority of those who will read this interview already know that you are
the Secretary General of Ohaneze NdiIgbo. Can you tell us a little
more about yourself?
There is
nothing new about me. I’ve been around for the past three score and ten years,
and participated in the vicissitudes that visited Nigeria since
the late sixties. I also went through the Civil War, thanking God for surviving
it, and still thanking Him for the strength and good health to be in Ohaneze for
the past fifteen years. And, today, being the Secretary General of the
organization, I have only one single vision in my mind: namely, to bring the
Igbo together towards the original objective of Igbo togetherness, and to lead them back into the primary positions
they used to occupy before the Civil War.
IGBO
DAY
Another Igbo Day is around the corner. What is the agenda on the table
for this year’s edition?
The Igbo Day will
come up on September 29. We expect that this year’s Igbo Day will
signal the beginning of a new era, the beginning of the total mobilization
of Ndigbo towards the singular objective most dear to their minds:
namely, to produce the president of the Federal Republic of Nigeria, come 2007.
Everything on the ground is pointing towards a level playing field, because the
present leadership has completed its tenure in office, if the Constitution is
to be relied upon. So, after this one, we intend that subsequent Igbo Days will be fully celebrated in
every state, and we’ve established it now that the 29th of
September every year, shall be the Igbo
National Day. It is our work-free day. It is also a day of reflection
for NdiIgbo, and we hope that in the future, instead of being
a day of sadness, it will turn out to be a day of rejoicing for NdiIgbo.
POLITICAL
PARTIES
Many people have reservations about the political parities we have
in Nigeria today.
Some say our present crop of party men are not bound by any ideologies, but
mainly by narrow interests. Is that your opinion as well?
Well,
ideology is a reflection of people’s mental attitude. You form ideologies by
packaging together your various expectations and working out a formula for
actualizing and concentrating on them. What people are saying is that the
political parties today are an amorphous grouping of people with diverse vested
interests, with only one common objective, and that is to use the place as a platform
for launching political careers. But to what end? They have no articulated
programmes, and so people believe that they are devoid of ideologies.
So, what does this portend for the country?
If you
look into all the political parties we have now, none sprang up with the
intention of ruling; it’s a grouping of strange bed fellows, each looking
forward to getting what they consider is their own share of the cake.
Now that Ohaneze is talking about the Igbo producing
the next president, considering that the person must come through one of the
parties, how do you intend to ensure he is not part of the unwholesome system
you have just described?
If the
parties we have now are the ones allowed to produce the candidates, NdiIgbo,
being part of Nigeria ,
will automatically use the material on the ground for their own spring board.
THE
CURSE OF OIL
People are saying that crude oil appears to have become a curse to Nigeria . We
have oil in abundance, but the masses are not benefiting from it; they buy fuel
at exorbitant prices; there are hardly any social amenities.
The oil
is not to blame. The oil has benefited us. Why do I say so? Before the advent
of oil, our people toiled in the fields, getting calloused hands through
farming and all sorts of manual labour. Today, you see them in their big togas,
in big babaringas, driving such expensive cars like Sheiks of
Arabia, and you are telling me the oil didn’t benefit them.
It benefited only a tiny few
Exactly.
What you should have been asking is how come we are in the midst of plenty, and
yet going about, cap in hand, begging. Indeed, just a few among us have
cornered, to themselves, the fortune that belongs to everyone. I will say that
the people are to blame, not the oil. It’s because they are all – even those
that we say are suffering in poverty – overfed, that’s why they are afraid to
scratch their skins. If not, why can’t they come out in their thousands, in
their millions, and pull down their tormentors, the few that have cornered the
things that belong to many?
A passive populace, we have then?
Passivity
is as a result of excessive craving to preserve the body; like the Igbo man
will say – “aru uso” – that is, when one feels so comfortable that he cannot afford to be
troubled.
It could be as a result of fear.
Fear of
what? If you are afraid, you will die, if you are not afraid, you will die. So,
why are you afraid, when you know that the ultimate is death?
MILITARY
INTERVENTION
People are saying that democracy has come to stay, but some others are
yet to overcome the fear of the possibility of the military staging a
come-back. Do you foresee that happening?
Who is in
the military?
The same people ruling now, I suppose.
The
military are you and I, our children. They are not strangers. They are not
imported mercenaries. Why should any one be putting it into their heads that
they must disobey the people that brought them up? Why should you be afraid of
them? If you are afraid of them, then disband the military. Why package something
that you will be afraid of?
The military was once considered the most effective platform for lasting
unity in the country. But it’s like at some point, such a belief evaporated.
How can
there be unity in an army that is packaged on what you call federal character?
People don’t join the army because they see it as a vocation; most of the
people in the army are surrogates of certain people who put them there for
their nefarious purposes. When we have a proper, well-oriented country, we will
put together an army that will be for the protection and the defense of the
people against external aggression.
I am ashamed to say that I have not read your book, Requiem
Biafra , but could you just share with us what you set
out to achieve with that book?
Requiem Biafra, first of all, was a book that I wrote while in
detention.
After the war?
Yes,
while in detention. I wasn’t sure I would survive the detention. And I was not
prepared for history to portray me unfairly. And so, I wanted to tell my own
part of the story, of what took place in the battle, before other people
superimposed falsehood on me.
MESSAGE
TO NIGERIANS
What final message do you have for Nigerians?
All I can
say is that all the ethnic groups in this country need to come together to
resolve their differences, and that without that, there is no other power that
can shape and bring about the Nigeria we all are looking forward to.
ON
THE INTERVIEW PROJECT
What do you think about the Interview Project that the Chinua Achebe
Foundation is organizing? What is your impression, having participated now?
I have
the greatest respect for Chinua Achebe, because I know him. I knew him through
the war. I knew him after the war. Achebe has a very brilliant, literary mind,
and from his books, one can see that his level of thinking is not just on the
surface, but deeply engraved. He loves and truly believes in Nigeria as
one, as do I and other true patriots. Consequently, I believe that whatever he
embarks on is genuinely in the best interest of Ndigbo and Nigeria .
Thank you very much, Sir.
You are
welcome.
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*Ugochukwu Ejinkeonye is on the Editorial Board of the Daily Independent, a national newspaper published in
***November 2005
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